News Media in Philadelphia Puzzled by Mailing of “Great Controversy” Paperback
September 10, 2015: “I turned it into an art experiment,” wrote Greg Adomaitis, a journalist for NJ.com in the New Jersey suburbs of Philadelphia after a 378-page paperback entitled The Great Controversy arrived in his mailbox along with 700,000 other homes in the tri-state metropolitan area the week of August 24. It was mailed by Remnant Publications, an independent ministry based in Michigan and included an appeal for donations and encouraged recipients to purchase gift copies for friends outside the area, according to Adomaitis.
The book “addresses preaching the ‘persecution of God’s faithful children’ and how the past shapes the purpose of life,” the journalist wrote. The 42-chapter book “dates back to the 1858 religious writings of Ellen G. White, who would go on to form the Seventh-Day Adventist Church.” He quoted the promotional piece inserted with the book; it “will help readers understand issues at stake in an ‘impending conflict’ and why the reader ‘cannot remain neutral’ [as they] learn about the geographic ties to historic religious events.” He reports that it is available on Glenn Beck’s web site, a controversial political commentator not affiliated with the Adventist faith.
Those who raised the funds for this mailing, which could be as much as a half million dollars, “wanted it to coincide with Pope Francis’ visit next month,” another reporter at BillyPenn.com quoted Dwight Hall, the Adventist who owns Remnant Publications. “When you’ve got such power and you’re getting into politics, that scares a lot of people,” Hall said in reference to the Pope.
More than a third of the nearly six million residents of the Philadelphia metropolitan area are Catholics, according to the United States Census of Religion for 2010, compiled by the statistical officers of the nation’s religious denominations. Just six percent are from conservative Protestant faiths, including 12,762 Adventist adherents. (Adherents includes children not old enough to be baptized and non-members who attend regularly, as well as church members.) That is one Adventist for every 467 residents, well above the one to 15 ratio in Jamaica, for example or the one to 20 ratio in Zambia.
Adomaitis reported that Remnant Publications aims at distributing 10 million copies of the book. It has already done so in New York City, Washington DC, San Francisco and Charlotte, North Carolina. Hall told the journalist that “many lives … have been transformed forever” by the book, although no research is available on the impact of these mailings. Residents have “taken to Twitter … to vent frustrations about [the lack of] ways of opting out” of the mailings, Adomaitis wrote.
This is yet another example of good intentions run amok because such actions so often cause more scorn and negative reactions than positive attention. Books such as “The Great Controversy” can have a positive impact when they are distributed to individuals we know are interested in the topic, or when God tells us individually that we should share a copy. But such mass distributions are an invitation to heap ridicule on the work of redeeming the lost and often make it more difficult for other evangelistic efforts later. Sometimes they create such opposition that other evangelistic activities become ineffective. So, while their intentions are good, Remnant Publications may have just done more damage than good.
I agree and would thus extend grace to those who truly believe this is a good thing to do.
William, God told Sis White that THIS BOOK was to be distributed to the world! This would be just like when we go door to door putting tracts in doors, leaving them at the homes we didn’t get to talk to a homeowner! What’s wrong with you? Obviously YOU don’t understand our mission, it’s to reach the world with the gospel of the kingdom, we are to scatter our publications as the leaves of Autumn! These are serious times we are to urge people, give them the opportunity to choose whom they would serve. THIS IS THE BEST WAY TO DO IT!!! Give me a better way than this! If I had the money I’d do the whole state of EVERY state NOT just part of a state, not just one city!!! Stop talking foolishness man and GET TO WORK OR BE LOST!!! AND, I say this to all who agree with him!!! Jesus and John the Baptist, Paul and Peter, ALL of God’s workers spread the gospel for EVERYONE to hear, so that the disobedient and rejecting, as well as those who would accept had the opportunity to hear it. You don’t just give it to those who are willing, because some may not be willing at first, but then in hearing the unbelieving HAS the chance to change their minds. Your way does NOT offer that opportunity! Look, we have NEVER been able to improve on God’s way of doing things like spreading the gospel, this is NOT the time to start! WORK FOR THE NIGHT IS FAST COMING, WHEN WE WILL NOT BE ABLE TO WORK FOR GOD. SDA members’ probation will close soon after Sunday law is enforced! BE…
BE READY!!!
The Great Controversy is NOT THE GOSPEL! According to the Bible, the Gospel is very simple:
1 Corinthians 15:1-4 NKJV
[1] Moreover, brethren, I declare to you the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received and in which you stand, [2] by which also you are saved, if you hold fast that word which I preached to you-unless you believed in vain. [3] For I delivered to you first of all that which I also received: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, [4] and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures,
Try Rom 2:16 and you will see that Paul’s gospel was far more comprehensive than the important principles of gospel history you mention. “In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.” And when the everlasting gospel is to be given to the whole world, John also teaches that it includes a reference to the end-time judgment. Rev 14:6-7. Moreover, The Great Controversy describes the conversion of several reformers in such a way as to will teach about faith, grace, forgiveness, and the gospel generally. So, yes, it does a grand job of presenting the gospel.
I have several problems with such mass mail-outs of The Great Controversy. For one, it is based on the misconception that it will be effective. Another, it has become the “go-to” tool allowing church members to feel like they’re doing something important for God when they aren’t. Add that it is a large narrative when few people read anything of such length any more and we need shorter, more concise presentations.
I agree with Patricia Allen that the book IS NOT the Gospel, but tradition has taught a lot of Adventists that it is, or at least cannot be separated from it.
Probably my greatest complaint is that continued use of the book sustains the false concept that spiritual gifts and prophecy, in particular, were concentrated in a single person when they are given to all believers. So we should not be expecting to continue using one work by one author when we can be using more current works by current authors who are just as inspired by God.
Amen
Well said, Brother Prewitt.
Thank you, Patricia,for that very concise and inspired explanation of the gospel. It is the gospel that saves us. It is a simple message of what Jesus did. How we respond to that news determines our salvation i.e., justified or condemned, in this life and the next.
The Great Controversy – the book is not the gospel but part of the gospel
Have you read the book?
I see far more people brought into a saving relationship with God through personal ministry of His redeeming love than through the circulation of any book. God’s way of doing things is not limiting our methods and tools to a single work by a single author and written more than a century ago, but through the spiritual gifts the Holy Spirit gives to all who believe so they can minister redemption today and do so with great power.
How many responses do you see to those tracts you leave in someone’s door? Very few, if any, because you’re pushing something at them they probably don’t want. But if you minister God’s love to them according to their needs and the power the Holy Spirit you will see many won who otherwise would not pay any attention to a tract or book.
You asked me to give you a better way and this is it: receive the gift of the Holy Spirit that is promised to every believer. Discover the giftedness God has already put in you to empower you to minister His love. I can tell you from experience that the ministry He wants you doing does not match your current concept of what it means to minister for Him because you are focused on promoting certain doctrines while overlooking the most essential doctrine of all: God LOVES you. Show them God’s love first, foremost and always and they’ll pay more attention to what else you want to teach them.
Mr. Noel, what would you do if were Noah? And What would you tell God about the people preached to preached? The pope in the dark ages were saying about the same thing about the bible that you are reading today.
Please clarify your question because I have no idea what you’re asking.
I’m actively involved in soul winning, and as a Bible worker, the Holy Spirit has led me to many, many people who received a book or tract in the mail, and greeted me warmly when they discovered I was offering free Bible studies to them. Many people have told me they’ve waited for days, weeks, months and even years for someone to come looking for them. Souls are longing for someone to care enough to search for them in love.
I can’t begin to describe how thrilling it is to realize how powerfully God is working in a person’s life, and to know that I could have a small part. I’m praising God for ministries like Remnant Publications and individuals who have a passion for lost souls.
Several have commented that book or tract distribution isn’t effective for outreach, but until you are actively involved in door-to-door work, you’ll never know just how many people DO pay attention to books and tracts. I’ve worked in many of our large U.S. cities, and I always meet those people who’ve been positively reached through book &/or tract!
Muriel,
Yes, some do, but very few when compared to the many that are sometimes distributed. I do not propose that we should stop circulating tracts, but that we should learn to use them more effectively. Books and tracts are far more effective (and less costly) when they are used in response to an identified interest or question. Identifying that interest or question requires that we engage with people one-on-one first instead of mailing them a book and hoping they will read it. Such mass mailings have turned into a waste of resources bearing precious little, if any, results.
Jesus never used tracts and never did a mass mailing. Instead, He engaged people in the power of the Holy Spirit. Plus, that’s how He told His followers to spread the Gospel. When are we going to follow His instructions?
Amen to that
You are right God loves the sinner but He hates sin. You cannot convince anyone to stop sinning because God loves them, You have to teach them to hate sin so that they can love God.
While we were yet sinners. ,….
God loves all of us sinners
I am so glad that Jesus came to a world that did not want Him and pushed me into His loving arms. Without His activism I would still be lost and without Hope. If people don’t want the book they can trash it but there will be those who will be in the Kingdom of God because of what the Great Controversy relates about Jesus and the Bible. Great Project. Keep it up!!!!
Nice… May you continue with the distribution
I believe many are now curious to read the book….. God is going to bless many through this ministry…. Keep it up!!!!!!
I think our definition of God’s Love is different. Noel have you ever read the Book?
So salvation comes from works eh!
Get to work or be lost is typical SDA mindset. We all want to go to heaven, but there is no merit in your work.
“Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.”
John 6:29 KJV
Alan, you completely incorrect that we believe you work your way in to heaven. But, faith without works is dead!
James 2:20 But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is dead?
Please don’t be a hater about a church that only has 16 million members worldwide and has the 2nd most hospitals and schools next to the Roman Catholic Church.
James 2:14 [ Faith Without Works Is Dead ] What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him?
Guess what? This is not the Gospel.
The Good News of salvation is NOT the bad news about the Catholic church. How much better it would have been had Remnant distributed THE DESIRE OF AGES across the land. It would have at least been Christ-centered.
I resent junk calls and junk mail I did not ask for, especially if it attacks another religion. Take a look at videos an material on line attacking Adventists–how do you feel about them? Your words carry that same tone. This book used harsh terminology from another era, and is not professionally written for today’s audience.
Such writing can bring on a time of trouble before we ready in my opinion. God should be our inspiration and leader in “evangelism” –it’s something He will open the door for as events unfold. I think humans take things in their own hands by going ahead of the Lord.
the issue has caused neurotic tendencies in some Adventists, especially children. I will never forget my uncle telling me he was so afraid of Catholics, he was terrified to pass a church. Now that is just sick! Recently when I told a nurse I met I was an Adventist, she stood back and told me they hated Catholics. She told a story of how an SDA woman screamed and would not let her treat her because it was a Catholic hospital!
Years ago in my childhood, I did hear a bit of Catholic bashing from some of my church school teachers. And I did read Great Controversy. And I like to think that neither of the above ruined me 8-).
In the 13 years I worked for a mainframe computer company, two of my closest associates were Catholics and one was Jehovah’s Witness. Despite our different theological views, all three were excellent Christian gentlemen.
When one of these gents heard I was an Adventist he remarked that the only thing he knew about Adventist was that they did not eat chicken (based upon one prior encounter). I assured him that many Adventists do indeed eat chicken.
When Ellen White wrote that every home should receive the GC our country was made up of church-going Christians. Now we have a large secular population. What seems to me to be more effective would be to circulate The Desire of Ages. What the world needs is to know Jesus and His great love for us. To serve Him out of love, not out of fear. The opening words of The Conflict of the Ages series is God is love, His very nature is love, His character is love. It ever has been and ever will be. The five foolish virgins were shut out because they didn’t know the bridegroom.
They were all virgins…. but 5 were wise and 5 were foolish and Sorry you have that wrong…. the foolish ones were shut out because they were NOT READY when the bridegroom came. Lets help our friends and family to be ready.
Brethren what else to do if was going door to door maybe this group would not have done this so I say every dollar well spent. Folks don’t complain when junk mail comes at door but only at word of God. Keep it up in your cornwe of the vineyard Clem UK
Let’s measure the results. The problem is you probably won’t hear about results because there will be so few compared to the effort.
The evangelism method Jesus modeled for us to follow requires that we first be empowered by the Holy Spirit so we can engage people one-on-one. Yet we fail to follow His example and wonder why the church is growing so slowly, or even shrinking, in many countries. Jesus never gave anyone a tract or book to read, but instead relied solely on the power of the Holy Spirit. So we need quit relying on methods like using The Great Controversy as our evangelistic “magic bullet” and start doing things the way He showed us.
It’s not about results, it is about leting others know the truth. They can either receive the truth or reject it. Remember Jesus himself and his words had rejected by many and many also had accepted received him.
David,
If you’re working in the power of the Holy Spirit, you can’t separate spreading the truth about God and results. If you’re doing what God wants you to be doing you WILL see results in the form of changed lives and new believers.
One of the great rewards of working in the power of the Holy Spirit is seeing lives changed as a result of your empowered ministry. Seeing results energizes you to keep working in spite of your trials and what you suffer. I haven’t been shipwrecked, stoned or beaten like Paul, but I’ve suffered injuries and pain in the course of my ministry. One day I was directly under one EF-2 tornado and less than one mile from three EF-5s and people died only short distances from where I was. Except for being under the one storm, God kept me unaware of the far greater dangers nearby so I could stay focused on the mission He had given me to do and I would do it all again in a heartbeat if I knew God was sending me there to minister His redeeming love.
Imagining you won’t see results is a clear measurement of your distance from the Holy Spirit because it contrasts so greatly with the Bible record of how the church grew when empowered believers spread-out to the world. I suggest you stop trying to share “truth” and instead focus your energies on connecting with the Holy Spirit so you can find the empowered, results-producing ministry God wants you doing for Him.
PREACH IT ROSITA, PREACH IT! AMEN TO THE BRAVE SOLDIERS OF THE CROSS. When the apostles and the disciples preach the good news, they didn’t wait or asked who’s interested or not. As the Holy Spirit leads you, do it, season or out of season. JESUS IS COMING SOON.
I agree , what has been written is fulfilling right in your own eyes that their will be hatters to what is right, go ahead my dear brothers and sisters in Christ your labor in not in vain proclaim the truth….
PLEASE…..GIVE ME A BREAK!…..YOUR NOT GIVING “ANY” CREDIT TO THE HOLY SPIRIT AND HIS POWER TO CONVERT A LOST DECEIVED SOUL
MORE POWER TO REMNANT PUBLICATIONS, PROJECT RESTORE, AND OTHER MINISTRIES LIKE THESE THAT ARE SPREADING “THE 3 ANGELS MESSAGE” LIKE THE “LEAVES OF AUTUMN” THROUGH THE PRINTED PAGE!
FOR SUCH A TIME AS THIS!!!
Ah . . . Hmm . . . a “Lost deceived soul”? And would Mr. McIntyre please favor us with his view of who exactly would be classed as a “lost deceived soul?” (I’m sorry to see that his keyboard has it’s shift key stuck so that he can only type capital letters.)
Neither is it the Three Angels message!
Jesus never gave anyone a tract or expected them to read a book. The example He gave us was simple: become empowered by the Holy Spirit so we can engage people one-on-one and demonstrate the love and power of God in ways that touch their hearts and change their lives. When will you start following His example?
Amen! Everyone senses that something different is happening. There’s no time for pussy footing around!! We need to follow the instructions of Jesus and his messenger. Spread the Spirit of Prophecy into ALL the world!!! This is the Gospel!!
I could not agree more. Again and again I see this attempted and always with negative results. It should not be our first book to the people. Desire of Ages would be so much better.
Scott
These people already claim to have a knowledge of Christ and are Christians, now they need to have the knowledge of the Anti-Christ
2 Timothy 3 King James Version (KJV)
3 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
Well said, William. Totally agree.
Publications are to spread like leaves in the wind.. How do leaves go in the wind? Everywhere. They will be blowing all over the place… So send them anyway they can. How many are you on the battlefield handing them out individually… Until you are in line with giving them out.. Best to stay the words against the good work done and being done….
Yes, she said her publications were to be spread: by individuals who make personal contact with others and discern their interest before deciding what is best to give them according to their interests. Where does a mass mailing make personal contact? Discern their interest? Give the option of deciding what to give a person that matches their interests? It fails on all three points so it is a misguided effort that will help a few people feel like they’re doing something for God when they’re producing no results for the Kingdom. What is even worse, it fails to obey the ministry model of Jesus who touched people one-on-one and then sent His followers out to do the same in the power of the Holy Spirit.
Please, don’t give us the old “if only one person is saved then the entire effort was worthwhile” argument because God doesn’t want us harvesting single souls where we could be drawing hundreds and even thousands into the Kingdom of God. I’m tired of all the excuses I’m hearing that attempt to justify failure.
Who are we to tell God how HIS work should be done. Does not the 3rd Angel’s message warn about the worship of the and consequences of that worship? Let there not be adoration and prostration before this wicked entity…People must be made aware of the issues that pertain to true worship.
Much has been written in recent years (not only in our denomination, but in the broader evangelical press too) about biblical literalism, and here might be a good opportunity to expand that topic to “Spirit of Prophecy literalism.” Mrs. White often encompassed a vast amount of territory in her general pronouncements, such as her advice on diet when she tells us all to eat less (this in a day before we knew about anorexia, etc.). Despite her pleas that we couple use of her counsels with common sense, there appears to be a belief among literalists that those who add “human wisdom” to the straight word somehow dishonor God and His messenger.
One of the great advantages we have in American cities is that we still have an ample chance to make first impressions—few people, especially younger folk, know anything about us. We must not squander those opportunities by presenting ourselves as socially insensitive controversialists. Some of us may indeed qualify on that count, but by and large Ellen White herself was most sensitive as she spoke out publicly to specific groups of people….
Try giving us a reference for the idea that all of us should eat less. That strikes me, an avid reader, as a gross misrepresentation of her teaching and much unlike what she has really written.
As a people, with all our profession of health reform, we eat too much. Indulgence of appetite is the greatest cause of physical and mental debility, and lies at the foundation of the feebleness which is apparent everywhere.—Testimonies for the Church 3:487 (1875). {CW 103.1}
To build on what you said, it also effects us spiritually. Jesus’ first temptation was food and if we can control appetite, we are better able or equipped to control the temptation to sin.
Rarely do I ever see Ed defending a position that he espouses. N.B. that often it’s just an opinion without any other backpacking.so long as it is an opinion.
Cont’d.So long as it is an opinion OK. We all have them.
What words or phrases immediately come to mind when reading about this “interesting” mailing of Great Controversy just ahead of the Pope’s visit?: “silly,” “stupid,” “you must be kidding,” “absurd,” “literalists run amok.” And those are the moderate ones.
I think “timely” is the most appropriate!!!
Catholic bashing does not seem like a good way to advertise our denomination. What unchurched person is going to be attracted to a church that discriminates against women and other religions? The good vs evil controversy is important but could the message be condensed and not include how evil SDA’s think the Pope and the Catholic church is?! I am embarrassed that Remnant Pub made such an unfortunate choice. They do not speak for me!
They do not speak for me, either! I would like to think that they don’t speak for the church. I hate trying to explain things like this, when people who know that I am an Adventist ask why we would do something so offensive!
Did Greg actually read his mailed version of the Great Controversy? He didn’t actually say he did –only that he received it. I understood that the new version of the Great Controversy has been revised to remove all derogatory or hurtful remarks about the Catholic Church. This was a promise the SDA leadership made with the RCC. As well, even our evangelistic meetings are not to address the Catholic Church –these are to be addressed in private meetings with only those who are interested in greater, in depth studies with the church pastor. I’m just saying.
WHAT?????
In 1948, the ratio in the United Sates of protestants to adherents of the Roman Church was over 3 to 1. In 2000, it was just over 2 to 1. In 2014 it was almost exactly 1-1/2 to 1.
If the ratio of protestants to adherents of the Roman Church was anywhere nearly as high in 1888 (when the GC was first published) as I think it was and if I had been urged to finance a mass mailing of the Great Controversy that year, I might have considered making a contribution because I would have assumed that almost all of the people who received it would have been protestants who, like all protestants from the 16th century to 1888, understood why the protestants of the 16th century considered the papacy to be the beast of Rev. 13 and the great whore of Rev. 17.
Not only is there a much lower percentage of protestants in the U.S. today than in 1888, there are few protestants today who are aware of how protestants interpreted Bible prophecies (by the historicist method) in the 16th century.
Whould Mrs. White would have changed some things in the Great Controversy if she had written it AFTER the General Conference session in 1888?
Be that as it may, it is a mistake to introduce historicist eschatology to people who are not acquainted with how protestants interpreted the Bible in the 16th through the 19th centuries. Putting the cart before the horse is an invitation to disaster.
I have a one word comment regarding the mass distribution of the book “Great Controversy” in Philadelphia: APPALLING!
Roger, The ratio you present of Protestants to Catholics may need some clarification so the wrong conclusions aren’t reached.
According to Gallup, the % of US citizens that identified as Catholic dropped from 2000 to 2014 (from 25% to 23%). So it is not that Catholicism is expanding in the US.
In that same time period Protestants dropped from 52% to 37%, however unspecified Christians grew from 5% to 10%. The % of Non-Catholic Christians to Catholics is still 2-1. I don’t know why the 10% of unspecified Christians stopped protesting.
Patrick G., HA!
thanks.
Friday- September 11, 2015
“Is The Great Controversy Missing a Chapter?”
Return to White Estate Vault Feature
Readers comparing the Spanish edition of The Great Controversy to the English original may be surprised to learn that the Spanish version contains an additional chapter—chapter 13. The origin of this chapter is explained in The Later Elmshaven Years, [vol. 6 of the Ellen G. White Biography series,] p. 377, as follows:
As the work of the church was broadening to take in many countries and many languages, steps were taken to translate the new book so that the peoples of many tongues might read. One of the first was the Spanish, undertaken almost immediately. As this work was entered upon, it was observed that no place had been given to the reformation in Spain… This chapter was compiled by C. C. Crisler and H. H. Hall, and was inserted in this book with the approval of the author.–Page 252.”
Most SDA’s have no idea that a chapter of GC was “missing”.
All this is to say that EGW herself modified distribution, shifted content, and made decisions about who, what, and when her writings should be distributed.
It is rude for us SDA’s to distribute Great Controversy to try and influence those hosting him in Philadelphia during this Papal visit. I believe EGW would denounce this intrusion. There are times when it would be better to postpone something, leave something out, EGW did, why can’t we?
Would we do this to a neighbor’s relative who is…
It’s just a book.
Those who don’t want it should recycle.
Those who’re curious can read it.
I don’t think anyone should make a fuss.
I don’t think it’ll make people anti-SDA. It may barely make them aware of us at all.
Most people will not read it. One or two said on TV that they will and that’s great.
There may be better methods by far, but I don’t think God is sulking. If God’s best labourers in sa culture are timid, traditionalist and uninspired–I think that He’ll use them still simply because they’re willing.
…visiting?
I hope not!
Spread the book “like the leaves of Autumn.” I think Autumn can be a beautiful time of year, but I don’t keep the leaves. I throw them away or mulch them as fertilizer or trash.
On distributing the Great Controversy “like the leaves of Autumn”? And then Steve says that he does not keep the leaves, he throws them away or uses them as fertilizer. Throw way the “leaves.” First class. Jolly good. Well put!
I think we should be respectful of others’ attempts to witness. In this age when the majority is doing nothing it is refreshing to see someone who is doing something. They took their own money and sponsored this project. I have heard plenty of positive comments in the media. Of course the media and the world wonders why someone would do this. I get plenty of things in the mail I discard. And I get some I would not have read if someone had not sent it to me.
I believe we should spend our time praying that God will bless these books and all forms of sharing. It would be a more profitable use of time than critcizing.
Instead of praying that the books will have an impact, why not follow God’s instructions and pray for the outpouring of the Holy Spirit on each of us so we can each be empowered to minister in the variety of ways He wants instead of depending on a single method and hoping a book will do the work for us.
We won’t receive any more power if we’re not using the power we already have.
I see no reason that we cannot do both. I am already praying that the the Holy Spirit will fill me and use me. Why should I not pray that the Lord will bless these books as well? The Holy Spirit can use books as well as people. It is not one or the other. It can be both.
william, why are you so set against this? how many people were positively affected by the book? you dont know, and you never will. if it helps save one person, it was worth the effort and expense. we are running out of time, in case you havent noticed.if people dont want the book, they know how to dispose of it.
If I’m against anything it is disobeying God. The ministry model Jesus gave us was one-to-one ministry where believers are empowered by the Holy Spirit and demonstrating the love and power of God according to their gifts. So not following that model is disobedience.
When Jesus sent out his disciples to heal the sick, raise the dead, cast-out demons and cleanse the lepers they returned full of stories and amazed by what they had seen God doing through them. The same promise of empowerment is given to us today, so why would we imagine working in any other way? Since that way was so much more successful than anything we’ve seen in our lifetimes, why would we not be at least trying to do things God’s way?
Agreed.
Most people are doing nothing. That’s the main problem.
Amen!
Well stated, Tim!!
Our parents told my siblings and me that we shouldn’t criticize or participate in discussions unless we had suggestions about how to address the legitimate concerns of even those with whom we disagree.
Space here does not permit a detailed description of the methods my wife and I have employed in our missionary/evangelistic work but we have encouraged thousands (perhaps ten thousand but that is only an estimate) of people to trust the Lord, study their Bibles etc.
The Great Controversy IS an appropriate book to give to people who are not only radically protestant but are acquainted with the way protestants interpreted Bible prophecy for hundreds of years.
There are even some members of the Roman Church who are sufficiently acquainted with protestant principles and the history and reformation eschatology to understand that, except for some details, Ellen White didn’t write anything about the Roman Church that protestants hadn’t been writing and saying for hundreds of years.
When someone noted that one Roman priest had the entire Conflict Series on his bookshelf, he replied that they were “good books”.
The problem is that, in the 21st century, most of the adherents of the Roman system are woefully ignorant of even what protestantism is–or was. For people who do know the history, it isn’t so surprising that Ellen White expected the Spanish Inquisition to be repeared in the U.S.
When Ellen White wrote that she wanted to see Great Controversy widely distributed, America was largely Protestant and anti-Catholic. The books dominant themes struck a receptive chord and the author gradually led the reader into an apology for Millerism and a call for Sabbath-keeping. This is not the America of today! Would she have given the same advice now? I suspect not.
In fact, she would have intensified the need a thousand per cent.
On what basis eternal to yourself do you subscribe to your statement, Bill?
The more I read Ellen White articles, the more I believe her between-editions changes to the Great Controversy, especially with regard to correcting historical comments, the more my sense is that had she lived, the Great Controversy would have morphed today as much as the words ‘conservative’ and ‘liberal’ have morphed since her day. Today, a conservative was the liberal in Ellen White’s dictionary. And of course, the conservative in her day is today’s liberal.
In her later years, Ellen White was very clear that the Gospel was personal, not religious. Indeed, she came to see Justification by Faith as the Third Angel’s Message ‘in verity.’ Justification by Faith has nothing to do with a clash between religions, and she new and proclaimed that.
So on what basis do you believe otherwise?
Well, one thing is evident. Everybody knows just exactly how everybody else ought to witness. If you think not, just ask them and they will tell you.
I won’t be telling you how to witness, but I’ll be quick and consistent in telling you to seek and follow the guidance and empowerment of the Holy Spirit. God promises to equip and empower all believers to minister in a wide variety of ways. So, why should we ever imagine that there is only one way to share God’s love, or even a limited set of ways? God is far more powerful that we imagine and is able to reach unto the uttermost.
God works in amazing ways when we allow Him to do it instead of imposing our concepts and rejecting what doesn’t match our microscopic conceptual box. For example, one of the sons of the founders of Hamas, the Palestinian terrorist movement, is today a Christian missionary as a result of his encounter with Jesus. Just a few days ago I saw an interview with a man who is planting churches in western Syria and northern Lebanon. Two years ago he was murdering people for ISIS, then he had an encounter with people who were faithful to God.
If you want to know how to witness, ask the Holy Spirit to show you. He will give you clarity where today you have confusion and concepts of what consumes your energy without result.
She never changed her view on anything she wrote in this book, Bill. Righteousness by faith is all through this book including the earliest editions. Her own understanding was more comprehensive than many in the church of her day. But there would be no need to change or alter any thing she stated at a later date.
Exactly–you are using common sense! As things are now we need to see how events play out instead of thinking we know it all. I am reminded of the Pharisees of Jesus’ time who thought they knew exactly what would happen concerning the Messiah–but they were VERY wrong. To jump to conclusions even concerning Pope Francis is wrong. Yes, the papal system is unbiblical and based on tradition with a history of persecution (even Protestants persecuted Catholics), but to make claims not evident at this time is a poor witness. I only hope Dr. Carson doesn’t get hit with this.
Well said. Also, I believe it would be well to try to ‘put ourselves in our neighbor’s shoes’ as it were. How do we respond to other denominations literature…especially related to prophetic interpretations?
FIGHT TO THE FINISH–GOD AND THE DEVIL DUKE IT OUT
Advertised correctly as a novel, the greatest SciFi book ever written, SDA Star Wars, the GC might be of more public interest and sell on its own merit. The dualism of good versus evil is the core plot of tens of thousands of books and movies. Good/bad elevate to cowboy heaven hasn’t been covered anywhere else, as far as I know with God and the Devil in mortal hand to hand combat. Risky purging of collateral baloney would be required for the market, of course.
That book is actually an ongoing reminder of what happens when an organization refuses to confess its sins, its mistakes, its false prophecies multiplied by meritless imagination and fearsome straw men. The book is an outline of Adventist prophetic and theological failure overlaid on borrowed history. None of the predictions or scenarios of the imaginary heavenly war have happened. But the church staggers on as if all is well and millions of dollars are righteously detoured to post office coffers and city dumps.
I bought into the literature truth bomb scheme as a young Adventist by spending Sabbath afternoons sticking brochures furtively in doors assuming the power of “Truth” would leap from the paper and capture some “souls.”
Obviously the myth of “Truth” osmosis to “souls” survives without being affected at all by the miserable, catastrophic, one hundred forty year and counting failure of Adventist theology as heralded in the GC.
I wish Remnant Publishing would have contacted the churches in Philadelphia first before they distributed the Great Controversy. Both the Allegheny East Conference & the Pennsylvania Conference will distribute magazines & Literature that are Family friendly, with information within it, if they want more. Catholic: Pope bashing is not a good ideal to win souls in this area. Christ Method Alone- MH 143.
Its really sad to see that the family friendly literature that these conferences are delivering are parallel with the ones that the pope intends to distribute and promote. WAKE UP PEOPLE have you read your bibles do you know about the 3 angels message, the AntiChrist system has almost taken complete control of the World, except for the remnant that will stand for the Truth.1Peter 3 13 Who is going to harm you if you are eager to do good? 14 But even if you should suffer for what is right, you are blessed. “Do not fear their threats[b]; do not be frightened.”[c] 15 But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect, 16 keeping a clear conscience, so that those who speak maliciously against your good behavior in Christ may be ashamed of their slander. 17 For it is better, if it is God’s will, to suffer for doing good than for doing evil. 18 For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive in the Spirit. 19 After being made alive,[d] he went and made proclamation to the imprisoned spirits— 20 to those who were disobedient long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water,
It becomes more and more evident that many professed Christians have no idea what Jesus commanded His disciples to do about sharing and spreading His Word in any available avenue. Soon everyone will have to choose between living His Word and anything and everything else. Only those who are reading His Scripture, praying and sighing and crying for those ignorant of soon coming cataclysmic events will be ready for the ongoing catastrophism scenario. Picture a large population that is totally without any conscience, totally insane; totally that has rejected any semblance of the Holy Spirit.
Seventh-day Adventists believe that “the writings of Ellen White are not a substitute for Scripture. They cannot be placed on the same level. The Holy Scriptures stand alone, the unique standard by which her and all other writings must be judged and to which they must be subject” (Seventh-day Adventists Believe . . . , p. 227). Ellen White herself claimed that “little heed is given to the Bible, and the Lord has given a lesser light to lead men and women to the greater light” (Review and Herald, January 20, 1903).
“By means of missionary visits and by a wise distribution of our literature, many who have never been warned, may be reached.–Review and Herald, January 25, 1912. It remains to be seen if a “wise distribution of our literature” works best of such a serious book as “Great Controversy” as the first item given to a Catholic audience.
I can see that without a proper context and introduction there are portions of Great Controversy that would turn off a devout Catholic. To those who would welcome an adversarial approach I would remind them of the many Biblical examples where Jesus met persons at the point of their needs with Scripture, comfort, and compassion, first and foremost, representing His Father’s love.
Based on your understanding of Catholic beliefs, think through carefully the best approach to reach out to them. What are some entering wedges that will allow you to be positive?
contact in a way that will not immediately offend them?
The following statement deserves a comment: “Seventh-day Adventists believe that the writings of Ellen White are not a substitute for Scripture. They cannot be placed on the same level. The Holy Scriptures stand alone, the unique standard by which her and all other writings must be judged and to which they must be subject.”
In 1975, I tuned a piano for the wife of the pastor of a “community church”. She and I didn’t spend much time discussing spiritual matters but she wanted me to meet her husband.
I hadn’t spoken with him for more than a few minutes before he asked my denominational affiliation. When I told him, he quizzed me about salvation by grace alone and the primacy of scripture.
I was able to tell him I had read extensively from SdA literature from both the 19th and 20th centuries and was satisfied that the organization had never taken the position that we are saved by works or that the Bible should be interpreted by Ellen White’s writings.
I took his response as rhetorical: “Does it really matter what the organization teaches if the majority of the laity believe otherwise?”
How would he know that?
ATT,
If the above-mentioned pastor had listened to the VOP or listened to Faith For Today, he wouldn’t have gotten the impression that SdAs teach salvation by works or that the Bible should be interpreted by Ellen White’s writings. I assumed that he had read it in non-denominational publications. Such allegations would not have convinced him that most adventists teach such things. His opinion was undoubtedly formed after more than one conversation with SdAs who had knocked on his door. Why did I think so?
Because after I had answered his questions (mentioned above) and after I introduced the subject of Bible prophecy, we spoke about that for a few minutes and he then invited me to teach an adult Sunday school class on the subject of Bible prophecy.
In the 1920s, when my dad first learned about adventists, it was customary for SdA pastors to NOT ask a congregation to approve the “reguar” membership of someone until he had attended adventist meetings for a year. By the 1950s, pastors were asking their congregations to approve “regular” membership for anyone who attended Sabbath services three weeks in a row and could answer, “Yes”, to a series of leading questions.
Until our denomination adopts a policy of NOT making people voting members before they understand what adventism is, the problem will continue to get worse.
I never cease to be amazed by how powerfully God can work. When my wife and I were working in the Greater New York Conference we knew a man who was from a devoutly Catholic family and who opposed his conversion in more ways and with greater vigor and subversion than I think I had ever seen anywhere else and it took nearly of his baptism his wife told him if he walked out the door that she would not be there when he returned. Still, he decided to follow God. When he returned home she was there and God was working on both her heart and her sister’s heart with such force that the next day they both were begging for Bible studies and two weeks later both were baptized! Other family members soon followed.
So true, Roger,so true
We are too concerned about offending people when our goal should be to teach them the truth. Even Jesus got angry and spoke in parables that angered people and also called them hypocrites and vipers. He spoke the truth and when the truth hurt them they killed Him. So are we still calling the truth offensive. Wow! Surely Ellen White was a prophet because she pointed ALL her writings to the BIBLE and All her prophesies are coming to pass.
Yes, our population is puzzled by evangelism since it reaches them so rarely by the Christian church. You will note that during the video, all who received it said that they were going to read it. And, the news lady ended up by saying, “Well, it worked! The book is going to be read.” See the news program video yourselves:
https://www.facebook.com/larren.cole/videos/1048596871828002/
Jesus said to ALL believers: Go, Teach, Baptize, Make Disciples.
When stepping into the arena to do warfare for Christ a plan of attack is needed. The goal is to MAKE DISCIPLES. The requires close and ongoing involvement.
Well intended mailing? Yes.
Will this mailing do some good? We hope so.
Will it do some harm? We hope not.
Was it a coordinated effort? It doesn’t seem so.
Were the local churches and conferences included in this plan? Seems not.
Church policy asks that when you go into another territory other than where you live, with the plan of doing a work for the Lord you check in with the Conference President so efforts can be in a collaborative manner.
It is a fact that the world must be WARNED of the rebellion against the Throne of God and His Law.
When the Art of War is understood, prudent “warriors” do not make a head on attack. They attack at the edges. Punch one is followed by a second and third, fourth and fifth punch.
Is this a well planned attack on the rebellion against God? It does not seem so.
Who was prepared to deal with the fall out or interest, if any from this mailing? Certainly not those who did the mailing.
When planning an evangelistic series of meetings I don’t know of ANY evangelist who starts with the Mark of the Beast.
EGW counsels that we mingle with people FIRST and show them our concern as Jesus did.
continued…
Amen. Run not before him (the Lord).
The time is short, working in the periphery has not been enough to hasten the second coming of Our Lord Jesus. Madness is to keep doing the same thing and expect different results. Leave behind the politics of the church and reach the people…Go into all the world. I applaud the new strategic approach of Remnant Publications. At the end of the day God will be the judge, the Holy Spirit will speak and the word of God says that angels in heaven will rejoice over ONE Sinner who repents. Let God Arise and His enemies be scattered.
Since time is short we should be following God’s instructions for how we’re to spread the Gospel, right? Where in the ministry model of Jesus do you find anything other than one-to-one contact where the believer is empowered with the gifts of the Holy Spirit? Where in the book mailing do you find one-on-one personal contact?
continued…
Jesus, healed and taught. His confrontations with those who disagreed with Him were always chosen by their attacks on Him. He never went spoiling for a fight.
Yes, the Great Controversy needs to be given to all. But let it be done as a follow-up as the situation indicates. If this is the lead punch, what is the following punch? Or is this meant to be a one punch knock out fight for Jesus.
Let’s pray for the best.
You said, “When stepping into the arena to do warfare for Christ a plan of attack is needed.”
Are we to do warfare FOR Christ or WITH Christ in His work? I believe there is a difference. If we work WITH Him we are following His lead. If we do warfare FOR Him then we do what we think is best. Just wondering….
I understand what you’re saying, but also think you’re splitting hairs rather than reading and obeying the handwriting that has been on the wall for centuries. The ministry model of Jesus is detailed in the Bible for us to follow. The Holy Spirit is promised to empower all believers to demonstrate the love and power of God and draw people into a saving relationship with Him. So, why discuss the difference you asked when we could be doing things according to His plan and in His power?
You are saying exactly what I believe – in His plan and in His power.
Was this mass distribution His plan as a means of spreading the Gospel because the Gospel it is not? I am in 100% for being actively involved in spreading the Gospel – the Great Commission given to all believers.
I think we should send a copy to each senator and congressman before the old guy arrives. gca
Another unnecessary, irresponsible, childish, and wild attack against another Church.
What can be done to not be identified with such a fanatic and arrogant group that organizes such a terrible event? What does one gain disrespecting other people’s beliefs? Can anyone expect respect and admiration for doing such a destructive thing?
My biggest concern is, Will insanity actually prevail among the SDAs?
Since this unfortunate initiative was not sponsored by the official SDA Church, I wonder if the GC is going to make any public statement distancing the SDA Church from this barbaric aggression to another Church.
I hope they would, but I doubt they will. This GC Administration has no backbone, and will certainly keep quiet thinking that, at the end, they may actually get some benefits from it without getting involved. $.CATCHIN.$….
At my opinion we should do something different, if we want to reach out people with our message first we need to show to the world Christian Values and witness in a different way. Instead of spending $500.000 in books, we should use this money to fund a project with the local churches in the Philadelphia area, where we could help the thousands of peregrims who are coming to the area. We should open the doors of our churches to provide shelter for those who don’t have a place to stay, we should provide meals and whatever they need during the Pope’s visit in the area,then people will see that SDA member live the principles of Christ. You shall love your neighbor. That was Christ’s method alone, Help them wit their needs and mingle with them. In this day and age, trying to reach people with a book that has more than 350 pages, and the quality of the printing is not the best at all, is blowing money to the wind, there are other ways to reach out people.
Well, since when has the Roman Catholic Church actually been a Christian Church? If one accepts the Gospel as it is in Scripture, one cannot accept what RCC teaches about justification, the very core of Christianity. RCC as a set of beliefs is a combination of some Christian doctrines with heathen philosophy. It is a result of centuries of apostasy from the truth. It has almost nothing to do with Christianity in reality. This was the whole point of Protestant Reformation.
Whether it was wise or not to distribute the Great Controversy this way, only time will tell. That’s beside my point. It seems to me that most of you writing against this are actually against Ellen G. White and the Seventh-day Adventist Church per se.
To say that we are insane when we oppose falsehood is to accept falsehood against the truth. You should know that by now.
Very intemperate statements, Tichy. Sad indeed.
David Kinnaman, head or the Barna Group research company writes: “In our research with some of the leading “mass evangelism” efforts, we found that often these measures create three to ten times as much negative response as positive.”
Kinnaman, D., & Lyons, G. (2007). UnChristian: What a New Generation Really Thinks about Christianity … and Why It Matters (p. 71). Grand Rapids, MI: Baker Books.
Christ’s method alone will give true success in reaching the people. The Saviour mingled with men as one who desired their good. He showed His sympathy for them, ministered to their
needs, and won their confidence. Then He bade them, “Follow Me.”
There is need of coming close to the people by personal effort. If less time were given to sermonizing, and more time were spent in personal ministry, greater results would be seen. The poor are to be relieved, the sick cared for, the sorrowing and bereaved comforted, the ignorant instructed, the inexperienced counseled. We are to weep with those that weep, and rejoice with those that rejoice. Accompanied by the power of persuasion, the power of prayer, the power of the love of God, this work will not, cannot, be without fruit. (cf Ellen White)
I am wondering whether Remnant Publications and its advocates, have taken the time to follow Ellen’s excellent advice?
According to this Atoday news article, the books being mailed include an appeal to send money to Remnant Publications. And Dwight Hall is quoted in the interviews.
Here is a bit more regarding Dwight Hall.
From the bright side of the force:
https://www.linkedin.com/pub/dwight-hall/21/a9a/699
For the dark side of the force:
http://www.save-3abn.com/danny-shelton-remnant-hides-royalties.htm
I am wondering if some of those who are bashing upon the book Great Controversy have bothered to read this book?
I have seen it used successfully to lead people to a closer walk with Christ. In a previous church there was a gentleman whose job occasioned a fair amount of public contact. He would discuss religious matters with some of the people he encountered. And to some of them he would give this book. And after they read the book he would invite them to visit our church. And we did baptize them. And they were genuinely excellent Christian people. And this book did not ruin them or make them hateful and spiteful and legalistic. And some of them were raised as Catholics.
God has different ways of reaching different people. And for some people this book is effective.
Nevertheless it is not the book I would choose for a massive indiscriminate mailing. I would prefer Steps to Christ.
I agree that Steps to Christ (or the Desire of Ages) would be a better book for mass distribution like this. Nonetheless, we should distribute the Great Controversy somehow 🙂
Christ’s method alone will give true success in reaching the people. The Saviour mingled with men as one who desired their good. He showed His sympathy for them, ministered to their
needs, and won their confidence. Then He bade them, “Follow Me.”
There is need of coming close to the people by personal effort. If less time were given to sermonizing, and more time were spent in personal ministry, greater results would be seen. The poor are to be relieved, the sick cared for, the sorrowing and bereaved comforted, the ignorant instructed, the inexperienced counseled. We are to weep with those that weep, and rejoice with those that rejoice. Accompanied by the power of persuasion, the power of prayer, the power of the love of God, this work will not, cannot, be without fruit. (cf Ellen White)
I am wondering whether Remnant Publications and its advocates, have taken the time to follow Ellen’s excellent advice?
According to this Atoday news article, the books being mailed include an appeal to send money to Remnant Publications. And Dwight Hall is quoted in the interviews.
Here is a bit more regarding Dwight Hall.
From the bright side of the force:
“www.linkedin.com/pub/dwight-hall/21/a9a/699”
From the dark side of the force:
“www.save-3abn.com/danny-shelton-remnant-hides-royalties.htm”
It seems to me that the Desire of Ages is probably the best book to mail out…
Jim Hamstra wrote:
“I am wondering if some of those who are bashing upon the book Great Controversy have bothered to read this book?”
Yes, I read it twice, first as a theology student (some 45 years ago) then a second time later on.
If the media picks up on the plagiarism issue, they will have a great feast.
Why didn’t they use at least The Great Hope?
Well, … on a second thought, this is not a good idea either. Imagine distributing a book that the supposed author never wrote, that is just one of EGW’s “post-mortem” books that lands on earth once in a while!
It’s obvious that the SDA vultures are attacking strong. It’s unfortunate that they fell for fanaticism and lack of civility when they decided to flood a city when the RCC’s leader is coming to town.
Still more unfortunate may be that the official SDA leadership will not make any move to distance our Church from such an low class event. I bet that many members will consider to distance themselves from such a weak religious organization, not wanting to be associated with it.
Yes, I think that using STC would have been OK. But, again, it would not have served the psychologically ill needs of the SDA vultures.
More than one person seem to be assuming that those who are opposed to the mass mailing of the Great Controversy are stick-in-the-muds who never do any home missionary work themselves.
The Great Controversy would never be the first book I would give to someone unless a) I had reason to believe he was radically protestant and b) I knew him to be acquainted with how protestants interpreted Bible prophecy in the 16th through the 19th centuries.
There was one exception: My wife loaned a lady Patriarchs & Prophets and Prophets & Kings for 6 months and she studied them carefully in preparation for teaching an adult Sunday school class. Then Sally loaned her Desire of Ages and Acts of the Apostles and she studied them carefully in preparation for teaching that same Sunday school class. ONLY THEN, did I give her husband a copy of the Great Controversy.
My wife’s favorite book (after the Bible) is Thoughts From the Mount Of Blessing. It is the book I most often carry with me (in addition to one or more Bibles) to supply to people who a) are functionally literate and b) seem likely to read it. Other books that might be as good a choice include Desire of Ages and Christ’s Object Lessons.
So now a question for those who think mass mailing the Great Controversy is a great idea. How often do you offer to teach people how to use a concordance and marginal references?
I’ve gone back to my special keepsake files and found a list of ideas that I wrote down from one of my favorite persons. Speaking at a spiritual retreat at Cedar Falls Camp, 1973, in Southern California.
H.M.S. Richards, Sr. shared these tips for Seventh-day Adventists in sharing their faith with Catholics:
• let them see Christ in you.
• be clear on your own Christian faith and what you believe.
• become more informed on what Catholics believe.
• develop a friendly relationship and get to know the person’s needs
• don’t get sidetracked by the thorny issues and don’t even make Catholicism the issue. Don’t debate. Start with God, Jesus and the things you believe in common.
For the past forty plus years of ministry this simple list has been like a lighthouse in the sea of life as I relate to my Catholic friends and others who have different journeys.
Hebrews 4:12 For the Word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than ANY two-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
Then Luke 8:11 Now the parable is this: The seed is the Word of God.
If you want to plant a seed, the Word of God, not EGW or any other man made words are of no effect. Mark 7:13 Making the Word of God of NONE EFFECT through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.
By delivering the Great Controversy you make the Word of God of no effect. It’s seen by heaven and those receiving it on earth as being placed first –above the Word of God –simply by using this tool as opposed to the tool God gave us –the Word of God.
Christians forget that it is the Holy Spirit that leads each one and only the Holy Spirit knows what to give, how much to give and at what time to give it. How many souls have been destroyed because people interfere with the work of the Holy Spirit?
Something we all need to consider.
Thinking out of the boox?
One of the problems in Adventism is that most members were (are) taught that they cannot “think out of the ‘boox’.”
Exactly, the red “boox.” On paper, Adventist doctrines are all based on the Bible. But this is just the façade portrayed. Any long term SDA knows the role of the ¨boox¨ in the formation of our doctrines.
Most Adventists don´t know, and wouldn’t dare, to “think out of the ‘boox’.” And imagine, even Ted Wilson in 2010, in one of his first sermons as the new GC Prez told the congregation that Adventists should only read denominational literature! How worse can that become?
I’ve already posted a couple of times on this thread but I think it has taken a turn that needs to be addressed. Yes, many SdA place Ellen White’s writings “above” the Bible in the sense of thinking that the Bible should be interpreted by her writings but please know that some people read those same books and are thereby encouraged to study the Bible FOR OURSELVES.
Maybe some psychologists could explain this better than I do but I think the difference is that people who are already protestant (not merely in name) subscribe to the principle of prior reference (aka the primacy of scripture) so they (we) are looking for inspiration, not guidance per se.
In either case (whether the person is a protestant or not) the best choice for a first book from Ellen White’s writings is probably Thoughts, Desire Of Ages, Christ’s Object lessons or (maybe) Education or Ministry of Healing.
If the GC leadership can drive away most of protestants by telling us to read only denominational literature, it will reduce conflict (the same way LDS minimize conflict) but the people who remain won’t be ready for the final conflict because they won’t know WHY they believe what they do.
It’s a variation on the old SDA viewpoint “I want to prove to you that I’m right, but since I don’t know my Bible well enough to use just it, Ellen White’s the next thing available to grab and use.”
Or maybe it is as simple as the BIBLE is right, Sound Doctrine is right, Ellen explains but does not change either and you are incapable of understanding any of them. But you still wish to be the aggressor, present your ideologies that you are unable to prove that fail all of them; while others are commanded to protect SUCH (and everyone else).
Simple child vs adult, structure and discipline theories in physiology.
The alternate contention of your present would be the BIBLE is wrong, Sound Doctrine is wrong, Ellen is wrong, the Church is wrong, the vast majority of the members are wrong and you are right? But hey, CHRIST did die to make you right.
I highly enjoy the Great Controversy, and use it in my classroom (although I now find Love Under Fire to be an easier read for my students). I’m always a little unsure if this is the best use of funds for evangelism, but before slamming the process understand that many of the donations for programs like this maybe wouldn’t come in for another method. When a donor comes with money for a specific cause, it’s not always best to try and get them to use it differently. If people are passionate about this method of evangelism and feel God has called them to it, I believe the Lord will bless.
That being said, given the free access to digital versions of this book, I’ve always wondered if mailing flyers with a QR code or iBooks/Google Books info on how to download with a short synopsis combined with email and social media links wouldn’t be a much more financially efficient method of delivering the book, that could reach 100x more (?) people for the same cost. The Adventist church for many years was constantly using the very freshest of methods in media to evangelize. If we can’t see solutions beyond mass mailings in 2015 we are now lagging behind.
If the Great Controversy is so important why depend or hire the Postal Service to ride on the coattails of the Pope?
Every employee at Old Columbia Pike, from the “Secretariat” to the janitor, should be required to take a rotating week off each year for local personal evangelism.
By knocking on doors and delivering Remnant’s supplied Great Controversy to every address in 20904.
Plus, for the “suits” at GC to personally make an appointment and personally deliver the Great Controversy to each member of the House and Senate of the US Congress.
Unity, evangelism, mission starts at the top.
LOL!
Very funny indeed.
Good luck with your plan!!!
The “guys upstairs in black suits” are more interested in “making plans” for the congregations. You know, good, attractive, efficient, and interesting plans!
The Post Office can take care of the other stuff… 🙂
Well, the book printer, and the distribution channel, have both received a blessing from the book. Financial! And the paper recycling business will also. And then there will be the odd person who reads it and decides to become an Adventist.
Maybe I should report back in a few years on the baptism trend in Philadelphia. If it achieves anything like the NY13 campaign, no positive difference generally will gave occurred, in exchange for much effort and money.
Ah, such pointed observations! I love it.
What will it take for us to stop relying on worn-out and failed evangelistic methods and start sharing God’s love in the same way Jesus showed us? Everything Jesus did was in the power of the Holy Spirit. So, what’s keeping us from doing the same? Just our disbelief.
CHRIST prayed to the FATHER for a comforter to be sent to us; so that we would not be alone.
John 14:26 “But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.”
The prayer of CHRIST created the Holy Spirit.
John 16:
12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.
13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, [that] shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
What will it take William for you to stop relying on worn-out and failed evangelistic methods? You and others took it upon yourselves and failed in such self derived doctrine. Maybe instead of speaking of yourself and relying on man, you should rely upon HIS PLAN.
1 Corinthians 2:
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man’s wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.
Your disbelief is what hinders others.
Why do keep making the assumption that the people who funded this endeavor were not impressed by the Holy Spirit to do It?
I suppose because I have seen too many people use the claim that God is in their endeavour to take anyone’s statement at face value. From the lady who gild’s the lily when reporting on bible studies, to the minister who rejoices in large baptism numbers, and then retains only 5 percent, to the big outreach in New York where the church leaders took the credit for the sharp lift in baptisms, which was followed up with a year with a huge baptism drop, resulting in an average over two years which was lower than the previous 5 years. And oh yes, there are the sanctified souls at the gc session that hissed at the former go president, and of course they were all led by the Holy Spirit. Too often we let our own ambition get in the way of the real Holy Spirit, and this is as real in our non church lives as our church lives.
And then I notice when the Holy Spirit has been operating in a very unobtrusive way, and I see amazing results.
Money is wonderful for advancing ministry. But we can throw it around, or we can be targeted in our approach. What real ministry has been achieved through a mass distribution of books that will largely go to landfill. Is it ministry, or is it politicking. I think the latter.
Something that never ceases to amaze me is how God provides the funds that are needed to do what He wants done. However, the fact that an effort like the book mail-out was funded may be nothing more than evidence of how many people have embraced the concept instead of studying to see if it is what we should be doing.
Because they’re not following the model God gave through Ellen White where people were to go out two-by-to personally contacting people and only giving them a book if they discerned an interest in spiritual matters. There’s a word in the Bible that describes when we’re not following God’s instructions: disobedience. Expecting God to bless our disobedience is the epitome of foolishness.
Sally and I counted among our closest friends a retired SdA pastor and his wife–both as delightful people as you could ever hope to meet. One day when she was in her 80s, she mentioned in her home that she didn’t think she was good enough.
I waited for several seconds in the hope that her husband would respond to her statement. He didn’t, so I made a short gospel presentation.
A couple of years later, after she died, her husband told me she had been very much encouraged by the way I had explained the gospel and that he was confident she had fallen asleep resting in the merits of Jesus alone.
A person doesn’t become a Christian by deciding to call himself a Christian. Conversion is the miracle whereby a person’s trust is transferred from what he thought he could do to save himself to what the Lord does to save us.
In an age when most professed Christians expect Jesus to return to be with us where we are, an adventist is someone who not only believes we are saved by grace alone through faith alone but also that Jesus will return to take all true believers to be with him where he is. Most members of of the SdA organization don’t expect Jesus to set up an earthly kingdom but if, as the result of mass distribution of distribution of the Great Controversy, someone joins our organization without experiencing that miracle, his “decision” is hardly reason to rejoice!
In an interview: “We have a lot of work to do to share the gospel in these cities!”
Why do they think GC is the gospel? It is a history lesson not a ministry of physical healing or compassion. It presents an unbalanced view of the life of the reformers creating saintly heroes. There is no reference to Luther’s views during the Peasant’s War or his intolerance of Jews and Muslims. It is overtly anti-Catholic which, in my opinion, is added fuel to religious intolerance. It makes a hero of William Miller, a person reputed as an extremist.
What our society needs is a re-emphasis on moral and spiritual values such as honesty, integrity, value of human life and property, breaking down racial and ethnic differences between the rich and the poor etc—not 500 year old reformers that hated the Rome of the Middle Ages. Not a picture that the worst sin in God’s sight such is US passing a Sunday law, whereas all other acts of inhumanity, injustice and breaking other commandments are insignificant.
Many years ago it was explained to me that the gospel itself was being admirably disseminated by Sunday-keeping churches, in fact that they were overdosing the world on Jesus, Jesus, Jesus, but without the balancing elements of the law and impending coming of Christ Himself to earth.
Ergo, it is our job as Adventists to add the missing elements, to complete the puzzle begun long ago by other Christians; to preach Jesus (it was said) is by and large superfluous, given our times.
Within that context, one seasoned theologian said it well, “Ed, the Second Coming is NOT good news to the sinner; it is the worst possible news. The only good news we can really share is that Jesus is our salvation and that we can trust in Him with absolute confidence now and through the worst possible times ahead in the Great Controversy.”
Paul warned the teachers of new Christians not to burden them with laws the Jews could not even bear.
But Adventists have never heeded that warning. It has never been enough to bring someone to Christ without also burdening him with all the details of the law, straight from Judaism. The law of Christ is the law of liberty which set us free from the heavy Jewish restrictions that the Jewish believers still wished to impose upon Gentile Christians.
The law has no salvific value; it is summarized as “Love God and your neighbor as yourself that FULFILLS the law, nothing more.
Jesus said, They will know you are my disciples by your love for one another. It’s no coincident that the fruit of the Spirit is first love, then the other virtues; i.e., peace, joy, patience, etc. follow –these are culminated through love and can only be had through love.
Elaine (and to whomever else this may apply),
Please be careful to make a distinction between a) adventists (protestants who understand the PURPOSE of the return of Jesus) and b) members of the SdA organization, many of whom are not protestants. Please don’t generalize with regard to the latter. There are still members of the SdA organization who don’t teach salvation by works; there are still members who don’t interpret the Bible by Ellen White; there are still members who don’t use the SdA statement of “Fundamental Beliefs” as a way to measure someone’s orthodoxy.
If you know adventists who tithe the herbs from their gardens (mint, dill, etc.), I suggest that you not tell them they are legalists. Instead, in the context of mentioning more important things, you might want to say, “This you should have done and not to have left the other undone.”
🙂
For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. Romans 8:3,4
Anyone that teaches the law has nothing to do with Christ, salvation, Christians, is not a follower of Jesus. Jesus, who is love, came to fulfill the law in us through the Holy Spirit.
How would you react should the mailman drop off a two inch thick copy of a religious book, requesting you send a donation?? The size of the tome would not fit in 95% of the mailboxes. Do the people have to visit the post office to pick up their copy??. Do you think the average mail person will actually handle all that extra weight?
If determined to give this book away to the people where the pope is meeting, would it be much more effective for 50 to 100 people to hand out postage free return postcards advertising the free copy of the book to be mailed to those who have an interest in it?? There will be approx one million plus people at the Philadelphia appearance. Or it could be offered as a internet download.
My choice would be offers of “STEPS TO CHRIST”, free. Let’s reason, only those impressed by the HOLY SPIRIT
will respond. Only a very few people read big books any more, except on kindle.
At my opinion we should do something different, if we want to reach out people with our message first we need to show to the world Christian Values and witness in a different way. Instead of spending $500.000 in books, we should use this money to fund a project with the local churches in the Philadelphia area, where we could help the thousands of peregrims who are coming to the area. We should open the doors of our churches to provide shelter for those who don’t have a place to stay, we should provide meals and whatever they need during the Pope’s visit in the area,then people will see that SDA member live the principles of Christ. You shall love your neighbor. That was Christ’s method alone, Help them wit their needs and mingle with them. In this day and age, trying to reach people with a book that has more than 350 pages, and the quality of the printing is not the best at all, is blowing money to the wind, there are other ways to reach out people.
Daniel,
There seems to be a wide array of opinions about what “our message” is.
Is “our message” that “only vegetarians will be translated when Jesus returns”?
Is “our message” that the only decision a person needs to make is “Which is the right Chruch”?
Is “our message” that “we” understand the Bible and nobody else does?
Is “our message” that “Satan is our sin-bearer”?
Is “our message” that “Ellen White’s writings are essential”?
All of the phrases in quotation marks above are actual quotes by members of “our” denomination. It seems likely that one of “our” biggest problems is that “we” done’t all agree even as to what “our message” is.
If you have any suggestions about how to clarify what “our message” is, please let us know.
Roger the bad news is that i know a lot of sad here in the South who believes that vegetarianism is the only way to heaven and also total submission of EGW writings following them literally , the Good News is that things are changing and more people in our denomination are becoming Bible Centered and Christ Centered, when this happens things will shake up.
Proponents of the idea of spreading literature “like the leaves of autumn” ignores a large part of the ministry model in which that line was but a small part. The concept was based on the idea that large numbers of believers would be personally contacting people and delivering the literature in person. So such mass mailings of “The Great Controversy” are not following the model.
The number of homeless people has doubled since Obama took office. Half of all immigrants today are on welfare. 57% of the population pays no income tax. Liberals are demanding more free housing, more free health care, more free food, more free college educations…….this is where love alone theology has gotten us. Yes we can turn our churches into shelters, but when we do they will remain shelters forever. The love alone theology that is being preached today isn’t what Jesus taught. Yes Jesus healed the poor, yes Jesus fed the poor, but the main reason for doing that was to raise the person up, to give them dignity, a sense of self worth. Jesus said take up your bed and walk. Jesus restored people.
Jesus came to get corporations personhood?
Daniel, a lot of people would like to play dumb as to what the message is as defined by EGW in the last half of The Great Controvery.
Anyone who wants to know can read it. There is no need for confusion on this matter, except by those who refuse to accept her explanation of bible Adventism.
To claim we don’t know what the message is, is a ploy to make obscure the fact that she has clearly stated it.
Bill,
If you are willing to impugn the motives of those you accuse of trying to “make obscure the fact that she has clearly stated it”, where does that willingness come from?
I’ve read the Great Controversy from cover to cover at least twice and I have studied it for fifty years. I think I “know” what the message is.
When, “the Spirit of God, persistently resisted has been withdrawn” the wicked will have “passed the boundary of their probation.” That seems to be what elicits the pronouncement, “He that is unjust, let him be unjust still” etc. That’s about p. 614.
Yet many take that chapter to mean that God will ARBITRARILY close human probation.
“With the issue thus clearly brought before him, whoever shall trample upon God’s law to obey a human enactment receives the mark of the beast…” That’s about page 604 or 605. I understand that to mean that both those who legislate against sabbath observance and those who give tacit approval to such legislation WILL receive the mark.
Yet many take that statement to mean that as soon as someone has been shown Bible texts about the sabbath, if he continues to worship God on Sunday, he has the mark of the beast.
How many have come to understand the mark of the beast the way you do from reading the Bible alone?
“The Bible, and the Bible only, as the rule of faith and duty.” About p. 204 or 205. Is that just window dressing?
Colossians 2:
14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
18 Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,
I always thought the infringement of the State was the issue (and Controversy). Our ability to serve as we saw fit within Religion; and the State to make those decisions. Much as exampled now; in the resent Supreme Court decision and infringement upon our Religious Rights.
Just my interpretation. Thoughts?
Concerned,
When Geraldine Ferraro, an adherent of the Roman Church, was a candidate for vice president of the United States, she was asked what she would do if the pope were to tell her to do something that violated the United States Constitution.
She replied that didn’t think such a thing would happen but that, if it did, she would rather resign as vice president than to violate the Constitution.
Maybe you know something about a recent decision by the Supreme Court that is an “infringement upon our Religious Rights” or events hollowing that decision that I haven’t heard. If so, please provide us with verifiable sources so we can be brought up to date.
If you are referring to the woman who wouldn’t sign a “marriage” certificate for a same sex “couple”, my sense is that she could resign rather than violate her conscience. That she apparently hasn’t resigned means to me that she wants to make a point by requiring the courts to rule on the issue.
If you have evidence to the contrary, please furnish us with verifiable sources that will help to bring us up to date.
I was actually talking about the Supreme Court decision of marriage. GOD created the definition of covenant and the Church had claimed such long before we were a Country. The 1888 decision defined the parameters and ownership. The decision of five, who took oath on not only on the intent but the content of the BIBLE, does not change that.
We are Caesar, we should complain as Caesar; especially for GOD. But we did and will continue.
The Clerk was elected by the People and took oath on the same BOOK; to uphold such, the Constitution of the United States and Kentucky. The Constitution, Laws of the Land, nor any build allow such redefinition and the Constitution of KY actually defines marriage between a man and woman. The US Constitution in defining the bounds of the Supreme Court actually removes privilege to entertain hearing of such.
Do you wish to remove her Civil Rights? Why should she resign? Why should she be forced to do anything against the will of the People or GOD; to entertain lack of Religion? The Great Controversy (GOOD and evil).
Concerned,
I am not willing to refer to a legal contact between to people of the same sex as “marriage”.
I’m not saying the clerk should resign. That would be the easy answer. If she is willing to sit in jail awaiting a court decision on the matter in order to force them to discuss it, more power to her!
Have you actually read what you call, “the Supreme Court decision of marriage”? I have. Soon after the decision was reported in the news, our conference president made reference to it in a sermon. Because he hadn’t read it for himself, he made a number of statements about it that were not true. He was repeating things he had heard from sources he considered reliable but, while I have no reason to think he or they were trying to deceive anyone, the statements were factually incorrect.
That decision was not an attempt to redefine marriage. It was about whether a woman who was “married” by the definition of Canadian law should receive certain benefits in the United States that would normally accrue to the surviving partner of a heterosexual marriage.
If conservatives in the United States hadn’t used the legislative process to give themselves certain advantages some of these questions would not have been raised when they were–if ever. Government should stay out of it–as I’ve been saying since the ’60s.
Yes, I did read the decision; and petitioned in Amicus Curiae. The intent may have been to redefine marriage; but did it not?
Did you wish to pay the $288 billion bill for this ruling? If the Government would have stayed out; there would have been no benefits.
All of these certain “advantages” were aimed to help families raise their children and create strong citizens. Children are an impossibility in this situation and actually become a byproduct. But instead within rulings considered “discriminated against”. The problem is a union without ability to be born; absolute discrimination. Absolutely against the Laws of GOD.
Most have no idea on the impact and cost of society within actions. Many have never done anything, had to provide or protect. These are the things and withing Grace of GOD generate wisdom. We need more wisdom and reverence of HIM; less perception.
If witnessing is necessary as the Pope visits Philadelphia, why not blanket mail a postcard offering a Bible or a New Testament on request. Perhaps the Holy Spirit and the citizens of Philadelphia don’t need the assistance of SDA literature which would interpret scripture for them.
Outstanding idea
Sister White would be doing this to welcome any stranger and witness to them:
“Sympathize with them in their trials, their heartaches, and disappointments. This will open
the way for you to help them. Speak to them of God’s promises, pray with and for them,
inspire them with hope” (The Ministry of Healing 157-159).
“Christ’s method alone will give true success in reaching the people. The Saviour mingled
with men as one who desired their good. He showed His sympathy for them, ministered to their needs, and won their confidence. Then He bade them, ‘Follow Me’” (The Ministry of
Healing 143).
“In laboring in a new field, do not think it your duty to say at once to the people, We
are Seventh-day Adventists; we believe that the seventh-day is the Sabbath; we
believe in the non-immortality of the soul. This would often erect a formidable
barrier between you and those you wish to reach. Speak to them, as you have
opportunity, upon points of doctrine on which you can agree. Dwell on the necessity
of practical godliness. Give them evidence that you are a Christian, desiring peace, and that you love their souls. Let them see that you are conscientious. Thus you will gain their confidence; and there will be time enough for doctrines” (Gospel Workers
119-120).
And time enough for the Great Controversy book. Why jump the gun? Sister White would have no part in turning this great book into an obstacle or hindrance because of our premature and insecure egos in being right…
Abusive, unethical, ineffective, expensive spamming.
I’d be ashamed if I lived anywhere near where these actions take place and people thought because I am associated with Adventism this had something to do with me.
A few instances of where someone reads it and becomes an Adventist in no way justifies this activity.
How not to win friends and influence the community, how to annoy a community and waste dollars and trees and community goodwill.
I haven’t seen this edition, but the ones I have seen a such cheap quality that they we a turn off and insult to those who are to be the recipient of this supposed “gift”.
I see some folks on here oppose any type of outreach except the “love them one on one” approach they say Jesus used. That books like GC should be done away with.
Jesus never owned or used a Bible during his ministry. Does that mean we should toss them aside also?
If the “love them one-on-one approach” is what Jesus used and you see the results it produced, why would you imagine doing any differently? Why would you expect God to bless the other effort instead of considering it disobedience?
William, Jesus inspired men to write the New Testament. I’m sorry you feel they were being disobedient.
Except for Revelation, the New Testament is primarily the personal accounts of those who walked with Jesus and letters to churches from those who had planted that church.
Inspiration is a gift not limited to Ellen White, but given in varying degrees in all Believers because it is simply God communicating with and speaking through Believers when the Holy Spirit is present in them. For example, a dozen years ago when I was writing a spiritual novel that Review & Herald published (and was on their best-seller list that year), God gave me a dream one night that was the exact scene I needed in a chapter. God often gives me thoughts to share with someone to whom I am ministering that are received with the perception that it is a special message for them from God. It is because of the power of the Holy Spirit that I have confidence to meet people and share spiritual things with them and I see Him changing lives as a result. It is a tremendous blessing I wish you were experiencing so you would be celebrating the works God does through you instead of arguing about how to work for Him.
Disagree.
Jesus said he would cause his disciples to remember what he said, and what he did so it could written down so others could read it and know who he is, know the plan of salvation, to warn us, guide us, teach us, encourage us, inspire us, strengthen us, remind us, to expose error, settle disagreements, build faith, change lives, change hearts, push back darkness……..
Perhaps you are confusing inspiration with the normal workings of the Holy Spirit that is given to every believer to help us.
How many of you consider the Bible an offensive waste of money, trees, good will, an annoyance?
To a Muslim it would be as you describe. To those of us who have a relationship with God, or who feel God alluring us into a relationship with Him, it is precious.
If something just arrives in the mail that you know nothing about and did not request, why would you pay it any attention? We imagine that a large number of people will read the books that were mailed-out when long experience shows us otherwise.
As a wise man once said, if satan is behind it this will soon fade away, but if God is behind it how can you hope to defeat his desires.
Clearly many Adventists object to EGW and would oppose anything that had to do with putting her writings into anyone’s hands. My comment was meant to show where their objections would ultimately lead. If we as a church throw out what some consider offensive the end result is the throwing aside of the Bible because some objection to parts or all of it.
There are many good people in this world that have love in their hearts for mankind and work to help others. The question is will a good person be saved without Christ. Can a person who rejects the Bible, churches, Christianty, Jesus be saved and end up in heaven.
Paul tells us God wants all mankind to be saved……and come into the knowledge of truth. That means God doesn’t want us to avoid truth, renounce truth, deny truth, reject truth, call truth error because it doesn’t fit our definition of what the right way to do things is.
The instruction Ellen White gave for the distribution of her books includes using discretion in selecting what to give to whom. No single book will be attractive to everyone and thinking one single book should be sent to everyone in an area is utterly foolish thinking, not to mention a waste of precious financial resources.
But it gets worse. Research by the Barna Organization shows that such action build resentment among the recipients and make it harder for future outreach efforts to find a receptive audience. So I believe we need to temper our zeal with some reality, follow the instructions we have been given and take steps to prevent creating future roadblocks to spreading the Gospel.
My wife, Sally, is 63. She has been working as an RN for 4 decades. This summer she graduated with a BS in nursing. We plan to move–probably to another state–as soon as she gets a position as a nurse educator.
I have some things I’ve been moving from place to place since before Sally and I met. Other things I’ve been moving from place to place each of the eight times Sally and I have moved. Some things I have been moving ever since my dad moved to Alaska. Some things my sister gave me after Dad died.
I’ve been sorting our things. Some of the things we have been moving from place to place will go in the trash. Some things we are offering to give away. I’ve already sorted our books and plan to give away two boxes of them. That leaves several boxes of books we plan to take with us, including two copies of the Great Controversy. I consider myself to have benefited from my over 50 years of study of that book. The question isn’t whether people benefit from reading it. The question is whether we should make an attempt to determine who is most likely to benefit from it so we don’t waste our resources.
Several years ago, we attended a series of presentations by a lay member of our SdA congregation. One of her neighbors, an adherent of the Roman church, came to the meetings. She indicated an interest in the life of Paul. I loaned her my copy of Sketches From the Life Off Paul by Ellen White. She read it and expressed her appreciation.
Later,our SdA friend gave that same lady a copy of The Great Controversy–and hasn’t heard from her since.
I completely disagree with the theory that it is because the lady was resistant to truth. I think it is very likely that if our SdA friend had led her neighbor first to an understanding of the basic principles of the protestant reformation, she could have benefited from The Great Controversy as much as I have.
First the blade, then the ear, then the full corn in the ear. First people crawl, then they walk, then they run.
I beg of you–everyone who is participating in this discussion–please find out where a person is in his personal spiritual journey and then encourage him to take another step on that journey. Don’t try so hard to make a proselyte that he becomes twofold more the child of hell than he was before. Don’t force people to make decisions they are totally unprepared to make.
Give away Bibles–but only to people who are likely to read them. You don’t need to converse with a person very long to get a sense of whether he will.
If conveying information “one on one” was the only God ordained way to spread information we wouldn’t have newspapers, magazines, books, radio, TV, phones, Facebook, or pastors giving sermons in churches………..
Clyde,
Is “‘one on one’ (is) the only God ordained way to spread information”?
First, evangelism isn’t even primarily a conveying of information. The first time I heard of a ministry called, “Amazing Facts”, I was reasonably sure that the approach being used was VERY different from what my wife and I use and VERY different from what I should support. Evangelism is encouraging people to trust the Lord.
My wife, Sally, listened to the Voice Of Prophecy regularly for 3-1/2 years before she requested regular membership in the SdA organization. She was very much encouraged thereby.
Did HMS Richards Sr. convey information?
Of course. But his plea was, “Have faith in God….Have faith, dear friend, in God.”
Sally and I have provided, at no cost to them, copies of Thoughts From the Mount Of Blessing to several people over the years (probably more than a dozen). On one occasion, when I handed a lady that book I predicted that if she read it, she “would fall in love with Jesus all over again”.
Do most of the people who read that book then request membership in the SdA organization?
I doubt it. But that isn’t the goal, is it? The goal is for people to trust the Lord instead of trying to set up an earthly kingdom in his name.
Are people who know which day is the Lord’s day less likely to try to set up an earthly kingdom? The goal is to encourage people to trust the Lord as creator.
Roger,
Amen! I used to be focused on making Adventists first instead of believers in God. Only when He reversed my priorities did I really start to see spiritual results from my ministry.
I praise God after seeing that you understand faith is the foundation we should all be building first and foremost and that evangelism is a long-term, relational process.
I also was blessed by the ministry of H.M.S. Richards, Sr. and heard him speak a number of times over the years. When I joined the staff of Faith For Today many years ago and my wife went to work at the nearby church-operated nursing home, I one day sought him out and found an old man sitting alone in a wheelchair in the day room. I told him I had joined the FFT staff and asked if he had any advice. What he shared was a wealth of wisdom. I realized later it was also exactly the same length of a message he would have recorded for a radio broadcast! About the only things missing were the standard intro and exit, a prayer and a song by the Kings Heralds! The one point I remember most from his instruction was that we need to be connecting people with the power of God so they can have the faith they need to get through today.
That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: Eph. 4:14,15
Teaching that all one needs is love, without truth, is not the truth scripture teaches.
At Pentecost the disciples preached to thousands shouting ” repent and be converted” without knowing any of them first. If first showing each individual love “one on one” was the required method Jesus wanted them to follow then we must conclude these disciples were not working for Jesus.
However since scripture tells me these men were filled with the Holy Spirit I can be assured that preaching the truth publicly is a God approved method of reaching people with the truth.
Yes Jesus practiced a one on one ministry, but the sermon on the mount reveals reaching people through a public ministry is just as important. God gives to each person a measure of faith, and then sows the seed into that faith; we are but the sheep that follow to help them come into the knowledge of truth.
If God put it in someone’s heart to send the GC to your neighbor it is wrong to call that good evil. In doing so you are judging God evil. We must not forget that God is in control and puts people in positions of authority to do his work.
Clyde,
You talk about the ministry of Jesus, but in John 14:12-15 He promises that believers will do even greater works if they obey His instructions. Why just talk about the ministry of others when God is waiting to show you the ministry He wants you doing so you can be effective for Him. Are you ready to believe the promise of the Holy Spirit?
Amen! Let’s not overlook that a relationship as you mentioned about that church member and their neighbor flows in two directions and the working of the Holy Spirit is on both of them. Formulaic concepts regarding what tools should be used in evangelistic outreach have been allowed to largely drown-out the role of the Holy Spirit in our outreach. As I have grown in my ministry and developed a deeper connection with the Holy Spirit, my perceptions of His leading have become far more intimate and a number of times I’ve felt His impressions to do or not do a particular thing and it was only later that I realized what might have happened and what damage done had I not obeyed.
I’ll be the first to admit I still have a lot of growing to do in my relationship with the Holy Spirit and a few weeks ago I got a stern reminder of that when I was in another state and turned to go to the local Adventist church instead of one about 30 miles away. Immediately, I felt like God was telling me to not go, but I went anyway and had the absolutely worst Sabbath experience I’ve had in a very long time. I’ve done some serious apologizing to God since then because I don’t want to do anything to damage my relationship with Him.
Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.
But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour.
If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master’s use, and prepared unto every good work. 2 Tim. 2:19-21
One other thing Roger. Teaching that Amazing Facts is an evil ministry you can’t support because you consider them wood and not a golden vessel like yourself is error. Just as the body has many parts, God has different vessels in his kingdom he uses.
So much of this discussion seems to be focused on “this is what works for me so everyone needs to do things this way”. Ironically that is the same “prescription program” that renders various church-sponsored projects and programs increasingly irrelevant as they ascend farther and farther “above” the local church, through the bureaucratic hierarchy.
“Just do it my way” seems to permeate religious leadership from the bottom to the top. And going along with it, the urge to stifle other ways of doing it.
There is no one right way to lead people to a closer walk with God. Different people have different personal circumstances. Different people trying to “witness” have different gifts and abilities. We need to trust and pray that God will somehow match people with gifts, and people with needs.
And of course, everyone can trot-out their favorite Bible or Ellen quotes (depending on which authority you prefer) to support their own methods, and to denigrate the methods of others.
So true, Jim; the false choice of only one method is at the heart of this discussion. There is a preferable, most effective means of introducing someone to Jesus, which is individual one on one contact; but it is absurd to believe that we are not to seek to wisely utilize every other method of communication; or to doubt that there are other means by which to inform those who have apparently been introduced to Him of information about which He would not have them ignorant; which is also our mission.
Stephen, I find it odd that so many of these “one on one” only supporters are on this world wide mass media website.
We’re her because of common interest and that is what makes many websites popular. Such observation and participation can stimulate interest, but for the vast majority of people it is still a personal relationship with Believers in whom the power of God is evident that produces significant spiritual growth and leads them into making a lifelong commitment to God.
So you feel the Bible also needs to be thrown out along with the GC?
That question was meant for Jim.
I didn’t trot-out scripture to validate any one method over another, it was to point out there are many methods to be used. God has different vessels in his kingdom that he uses to do his work. It is callus to say someone has wasted their time and money by working in the way you disapprove.
If this was intended for me, then I am puzzled.
Where ever did I say we should throw-out the Bible or the GC? I have given away both Bibles and Ellen books to people who showed an interest.
I have sold “truth filled literature” door-to-door. I also have handed-out tracts door-to-door inviting people to enroll in Bible studies. And I have gone to houses to respond when people mailed-in their cards.
I can tell you that “cold-calling” on people that do not know you is a very inefficient way to reach people with whatever you are selling. You have to knock on an awful lot of doors to get very few positive responses.
And I well remember the Sabbath afternoon where, after praying together for the Lord to go with us, I took my handful of response cards from some mass media appeal, and went to knock on the doors of these “leads”. At every door the person who answered claimed to have no clue why I was there. Someone else (one of their kids?) had filled-in the card or made the call, or they themselves had forgotten about it. Again, a very inefficient way to reach people.
Ditto for going out and inviting strangers to come to meetings, which I have also done.
Years ago my local conference did a mass-mailing covering the entire major metropolitan area, offering free seminars on Revelation at various “neutral” venues. The seminar to be conducted by Yours Truly and one of my friends (both church elders and experienced SS teachers), received by far the largest response (20 to 30 people).
We had several different sets of lessons from which to choose. After much prayer and study and discussion we decided not to use any of them, but to do our own outline focusing on the love of Jesus as revealed in Revelation. After our brief series of classes, we had three genuine “interests” – one young man and two middle-aged women.
One of the women was well-versed in the Bible and primarily wanted to understand our take on Revelation so she could compare it with others she had encountered. She did have some interesting discussions with me one-on-one, and asked me for some other Bible study recommendations for her daughter. Being well-connected in her existing church, she was really not looking to change.
(to be continued)
After visiting the other woman and the young man in their homes, we invited both of them to our local church and they did actually come a few times. What happened still pains me to recall.
First, our new pastor completely ignored them because (among other things) they were not “his” contacts from “his” programs. As head elder at the time, this triggered some alarms in the back of my head. I have met very few pastors who would not jump at the chance to lead some new seeker “into the tank”. And the exceptions were pastors who were immersed in their own personal struggles (and he was).
Second, both of these dear people had personal felt needs where our congregation was not equipped to minister. A very damning discovery, considering we had been the largest and fastest-growing and most “successful” church within hundreds of miles.
Needless to say these two good people soon lost interest in our church.
The Great Controversy mailing may ultimately leave a perception more about the Christian temperament and social intelligence of those who who have sponsored the mailing, than about the character of the Papal system and its new leader.
So you feel those that mailed the book out, the author of said book, and the spirit this inspired it all evil?
I personally feel very supportive of Ellen White.In fact I am jealous for her good reputation and the good reputation of our church, through this all.
Even good things can be turned for evil if they are not used properly. Water hydrates the body but you can also drown. Reading the Bible leads to salvation, but when it is not delivered in an attractive way the presentation creates offenses that make future outreach efforts more difficult.
The instruction we were given was to go out two-by-two, meet the people, discern if there was spiritual interest and then give them literature matching their interest. A mass mail-out removes the personal contact and spiritual discernment from the process and sending a single title because that is what we want them to know fails to match what spiritual interest may exist. Hoping the effort will be successful is no substitute for following the instructions to meet people where they are and nurture their faith starting with wherever they are.
Jesus traveled alone, Jesus traveled with two, Jesus traveled with twelve, Jesus traveled with hundreds. There was no one hard and fast rule he used or taught. When Jesus send his disciples out by two’s it was meant to be a training exercise and not to establish a rule how it was to be done every time.
When Jesus wanted to talk with the women at the well he sent all 12 of the disciples away together. That event shouldn’t be taken to mean we must only go out in groups of twelve.
Another time Jesus sent the twelve to Jerusalem for the Passover and he went another route by himself. Another time he sent the twelve across the lake in a boat and he walked across the lake. Another time he sent the twelve away and he went off to a mountain to pray.
There are many more examples of Jesus sending the twelve out together alone then there are of Jesus sending them out by two’s, but I don’t think we are going to see the church teaching that we’ve been wrong in the past and from now on members can only go out to witness in groups of twelve.
We are told three angels will be flying in the heavens proclaiming the gospel to the entire world……there couldn’t be a bigger mass mailing type of outreach then that…….yet we have good brothers and sisters on this website openly saying such a thing would be wrong because God only only carries out his work one on one, or by two’s…..
……God has used a donkey, floods, frogs, pagan kings, the Sun, bread, or a cross to…
Had you lived during the reformation you would have termed the reformers evil men just like the Catholic Church did.
Incidents like seeing Luther nail the 91 thesis would have left you very upset
Clyde,
I appreciate what you’ve had to say about this. As I think about it however, the horses are already out of the barn, and those who regret that they are, are now trying to close the door. You and I on the other hand are happy that the horses have been released to go and we’re trusting that they will now be finding other pastures in which to roam.
In any case, why should we argue about the merits of that which has already been accomplished? We should perhaps just be grateful that it has been accomplished, and hope and pray that the horses, now freed, do whatever horses are designed by their Creator to do.
Stay involved.
I get the feeling some would like to see the horses shot to insure they don’t get out next time.
God Bless.
So, do you approve of disobedience to God’s specific instructions?
God told Moses to speak to the rock so it would give water to the people, but when he hit the rock instead, God punished his disobedience by not letting him live to enter the Promised Land.
Through Ellen White, God gave specific instructions for how her books were to be distributed. We were to go two-by-two into the community, engage with people and when we had discerned their spiritual interest only then give them literature. More than that, we are to go with different tracts and books so we can give a person something that speaks to their area of interest. So, how does a one-size-fits-all approach of mailing “The Great Controversy” to every address in an area follow the instruction we were given? How does mailing it without first engaging people to discern their interest follow the instruction? How does not going in-person and two-by-two obey the instruction?
If we’re not following the instructions given, we’re disobeying. A quick look in any Bible concordance will lead you to many texts detailing God’s opinion of disobedience and the penalties we risk by not doing things as we’re told to do them.
I have asked for this previously, but please provide the specific EGW reference in which she says that there is only one approved way to distribute her writings; and that that exclusive way is precisely as you have described.
Otherwise we have nobody’s word on this other than yours.