New Information about Ordination of Women Clergy in the Adventist Church Continues to Surface
by AT News Team
The Seventh-day Adventist Church in the Netherlands may not wait until after the 2015 General Conference (GC) Session to end gender discrimination in ordination. When two previous studies of the topic were conducted by the GC it was the intervention of top denominational administrators, not prohibitions from Scripture or Adventist heritage that blocked women being ordained. More ordinations were approved for women last week. All of these facts have come to Adventist Today over the weekend.
“The delegates have asked the executive committee to implement equality as soon as possible,” Adventist Today was told by Tom de Bruin, executive secretary of the Netherlands Union Conference. The recent constituency session gave the union executive committee the authority to decide how rapidly it can implement the goal of ending general discrimination in ordination which was voted by session. The idea of waiting for the GC, as reported by Adventist Today last week, “is not part of the motion” voted by the delegates, Pastor de Bruin stated.
Pastor de Bruin provided a more accurate translation of what was voted by a large majority of the delegates: “Considering the biblical principle of the equality of men and women, the delegates indicate that they reject the current situation of inequality in the church on principle. For this reason, and considering the context of Dutch society, they charge the Executive Committee to vigorously promote this perspective in the worldwide church. As quickly as possible, and no later than six months after the next session of the General Conference (2015), equality between men and women will be implemented at all organizational levels of the church in the Netherlands. The equal ordination of female pastors also falls in this category.”
A paper by Bert Haloviak, who retired in 2010 as director of archives and statistics for the GC, documents the history of the GC studies on this topic in the early 1970s and late 1980s. It was published this week in Spectrum, the journal of the Association of Adventist Forums, the largest group of Adventist academics. In both cases the Bible scholars, theologians and historians who studied the topic found nothing in Scripture or the writings of Ellen G. White which prohibit ordaining women or women serving as leaders of congregations or other church organizations.
The original study commission recommended that at the 1975 GC Session initial steps be taken toward ordaining women, but this recommendation was diverted by GC President Robert Pierson. Again, leading up to the 1990 GC Session, the Bible scholars were prepared to recommend approval of the practice, but church administrators moved the process away from such an outcome.
“This information clearly shows why many people do not trust the current study,” a retired denominational official told Adventist Today. “Have key leaders already made up their minds? Will we get an honest result? This requires action, not just words of assurance.”
The current print issue of Adventist Today was published last week. It includes an article by Pastor Randy Roberts, senior pastor of the Loma Linda University Church, which reviews the major objections to the current steps taken by four union conferences around the world as well as the Adventist Church in China. Pastor Roberts carefully reviews the Bible reasons for the actions taken to end gender discrimination in ordination.
On Thursday last week (November 15), the executive committee of the Pacific Union Conference approved seven more women for ordination along with two men. “This vote removes any reservations or limitations on the church’s affirmation of the ministry to which God has called these pastors and trainers of pastors,” stated Pastor Bradford Newton, executive secretary of the union conference. The number of women ministers approved for ordination in the Pacific Union now stands at 21.
Now is the Right Time to do the Right Thing. The Netherlands Church is to be commended for valiantly striving toward the goal of equality. The intervention of "leadership" to repeatedly divert union action on women's ordination sadly shows their true motivation is more toward the protection of male privilege and church tradition than the spreading of the gospel. Denying women's ordination is not Biblical, it is not Moral and it is not the Right thing to do. Much too much time has been spent on dodging and diverting. They don't get to have it both ways. It is long past time to begin to follow the bidding of the Holy Spirit, rather than that of mere men. Spiritual leadership should come from Bible scholars and theologians, not administrators and beaurosaurs.
Please show me where womens ordiation is Biblical? It's not there, and because not there, some seem to think it must be ok…. The right thing to do is certainly not to run with culture but to follow the examples that are in the Word and writings of SOP.
The right thing to do is not to rebel against the world church, now is time for unity in the Truth. It seems for a few the idea of congregationalism is more important than unity based on Truth in the world church.
Your right you can't have it both ways…. some are clearly finding that out (re: "War on Men" by Suzanne Venke Nov. 24, 2012)
There have been multiple arguments made for women's ordination on a biblical basis on this and other sites. There have been literally hundreds of books written on it by well respected theologians. And still you insist no argument can be made. Sounds sort of like Jesus' argument that is people won't listen to Moses, then even someone resurrected from the dead won't get a hearing. You may not be convinced by teh arguments being made, but to insist that there are none when many have been made suggests losing touch with reality.
Should the world church decide women's ordination is OK, will you accept that, or suddenly find that being 'in rebellion' has somehow become the 'righteous' thing to do?
Yes, there have been arguments made from the Bible I agree, yet please show me one example ordination of women priest/elder/apostle from the Bible. Or where the SOP mentions women as pastor/shepherds of the home or church. You say "should the world church decide" yet the rogue unions continue to take the matter in there own hands which will lead to congregationalism as there actions are mimicked on the church level….
Why not wait until the matter is resolved before voting in the pastors? If the world church decides women's ordination is not ok will the rebellion suddenly stop?
If you assume both apostles and deacons were 'ordained', then Junia and Phoebe are examples of women who were ordained. It seems likely Priscilla and Phoebe were also ordained from the way they are mentioned.
I am not a supporter of congregationalism, but neither am I a supporter of the GC gathering all power to itself. I personally believe the issue has been mishandled for a long time, and the GC has to bear a large part of the responsibility for that. We should never have split the decision on women as elders from the decision on women as pastors, and the decision on ordaining women as both was effectively made when we decided they could have the role of elder and pastor.
Kevin I do not disagree that this issue has been mishandled for a long time. When you look at the history and timing of events there were steps taken for appeasement that gradually brought this into play. I also agree that a elder/pastor are much the same. For many cased the Elders are the pastor while the pastor is away.
For those who wish to limit the church's positions to what was recorded in the NT, it will be most of what is currently practiced. It takes no thought to condemn something suggested for today and rejecting it on the basis of its not being used in the early church. The early church did not believe Jesus was God, did not believe in the Virgin Birth, did not have any day as sacred and that is only the beginning. The church is always evolving: it is not the same today as when Adventism began. No longer do Adventists believe in the Shut Door, as they did for several years in the beginning. A list several pages long could illustrate these facts for those who are ignorant of them.
All4Him,
You asked us to show you where the ordination of women was Biblical. I ask you to show where the ordination or anyone is Biblical. That is because ordination is an invention of the church to establish and preserve clerical authority and very different from anything described in scripture.
William if ordination is an "invention" I would think Acts 6 should apply for a patent…. Why did Ellen White mention this with great prominence?
Choose Wise Men—For years the Lord has been instructing us to choose wise men,-men who are devoted to God,—men who know what the principles of heaven are,-men who have learned what it means to walk with God,—and to place upon them the responsibility of looking after the business affairs connected with our work. This is in accordance with the Bible plan as outlined in the sixth chapter of Acts. We need to study this plan; for it is approved of God. Let us follow the Word.—The Review and Herald, October 5, 1905.
Acts 6:3, Acts 6:4, Acts 6:5, Acts 6:6
All4Him,
What is described in Acts 6 and the modern concept of ordination are two very different things. What you find there is an act of bestowing a greater measure of the Holy Spirit on a person who is already obviously empowered and ministering according to their giftedness.
As for what Ellen White wrote, her counsel is that we should pick people for leadership who are obviously empowered by the Holy Spirit according to the example in Act 6. The central issue is empowerment by the Holy Spirit and ministry using that power.
Let's take things a step further. If you believe Ellen White was inspired, then I am hopeful you will be just as willing to embrace and obey her counsel that we should be following the Bible and the Bible only and that we should never, under any circumstance, use her writings as the basis for anything we believe, teach or practice. Remember, her counsel was to use the Bible and the Bible ONLY, not her writings.
William her writings point to the Bible like the prophets of the past. She states "let us follow the Word" and that is what we should do and choose wise men. Please give me the EGW quote you are using…. I sure will study study it out, Let me know as soon as you find it Thanks!
Willaim you mentioned "ANYTHING we teach, believe, or practice" still waiting for the quote?
When she mentions the Bible plan of Acts Six in the above quote and says it is approved of God and to follow the Word, she has based her words on the Bible.
All4Him,
I apologize for not responding earlier.
You claim to be a follower of Ellen White so I assume you have available to you various tools for searching her writings. You may answer your own question by searching for the phrase "Bible only" to see what she says about how we should be using scripture alone.
One of the most specific admonitions she gave to pastors was delivered at the ministers meeting prior to a general conference session that, if I recall correctly, was held in 1886, where she declared "…don't you never say 'Sister White this' or 'Sister White that.' Instead, let your words be 'Thus saith the Lord' from scripture alone." In that same message she told pastors that, if they couldn't prove everything they said from the Bible and the Bible alone that they should shut up, leave the pulpit and study their Bibles until they could prove everything from the Bible alone.
Ellen White said she was the "lesser light" pointing us to the "greater light" which is scripture. If someone points you in a direction and tells you to go that way, you stop looking at them and look in the direction toward which you have been pointed. So, since she is pointing you to the Bible, how are you not disobeying her instruction by continuing to study her writings and use them as authoritative?
William I searched for the quote you had given on "teach,believe,and practice" and had found nothing. Thus saith the Lord is what we need to follow. It was Gods speaking in Genesis 3:16. As I said before her writtings on this matter point directly to God's Word in Acts 6. The Bible is clear by teaching and example in the area of men being the shepherd of the home and the church.
In the one quote above I placed four text below it which decribe what EGW was saying. Another few would be Acts 6:7, Acts 6:8, Acts 6:9, Acts 6:10 thru verse 15.
We need to follow "the great light" rather then trying to drum up some new…..
You will not find a specific quote matching the specific search you described. Nor do I believe any of her statements will convince you otherwise on either the use of her writings or the ordination of women. Please watch to see whether or not God blesses the ministry of women because that is all that matters. Considering how slowly the church is growing in many places, if not shrinking, things couldn't get much worse.
Yes I believe women are blessed by God in ministry thoughout the ages and Yes they are needed to finish the work. The Bible is full of examples of Godly women working for the Lord. There is no Biblical example of women's role to be the priest/pastor of the home or the church.
Are you saying that God is incapable of doing things you have not imagined and working in ways you have not seen?
No William I'm saying He has made a clear path to follow in His Word…. Look at the examples of the first Churches that deviated from His path on this matter and see who they are ordaining now…